cbs2newengland 71 Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I had seen an open from KNBC circa late 1993/1994 that isn't on the NMSA that's not the NewsCenter nor is it the Michael Boyd theme. This open features the "News 4" mandated logo and the European caption like graphics package, despite the a shot of their newsroom showing the 1986 logo. Does anyone know when this theme began? I'm betting 1993. I am suspecting it was a slow change, since there is another KNBC Today in LA open that used the Randall theme with the old logo but a 90s looking graphics likely that same year (even the description notes the dual look.) The clip states '94, but I am still betting it was mid to late 1993. I've always wondered why it took so long for NBC to jump into the 90s in the graphics, opens, etc since it seemed like most NBC O&Os wanted to look like the 80s as long as possible before they looked very dated. If I remember, it was CBS, then NBC then ABC (some stations still were using titles that were originally designed in 1988) well into the mid 90s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfomspphl 453 Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 I've always wondered why it took so long for NBC to jump into the 90s in the graphics, opens, etc since it seemed like most NBC O&Os wanted to look like the 80s as long as possible before they looked very dated. If I remember, it was CBS, then NBC then ABC (some stations still were using titles that were originally designed in 1988) well into the mid 90s. Rank order of success dictated the lack of change. The ABC O&Os tended to have the biggest market share, so why mess with something working. NBC middle of the pack, with KNBC one of the stronger ones. CBS always a mess back then, so it was flavor of the month for graphics. Also recall CNN kept its red line graphics well into the 90s, and back then was considered a growth story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ntropolis 593 Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 I had seen an open from KNBC circa late 1993/1994 that isn't on the NMSA that's not the NewsCenter nor is it the Michael Boyd theme. This open features the "News 4" mandated logo and the European caption like graphics package, despite the a shot of their newsroom showing the 1986 logo. Does anyone know when this theme began? I'm betting 1993. I am suspecting it was a slow change, since there is another KNBC Today in LA open that used the Randall theme with the old logo but a 90s looking graphics likely that same year (even the description notes the dual look.) The clip states '94, but I am still betting it was mid to late 1993. Anyone else feel an Arnold vibe with this theme? The headline bed in particular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbs2newengland 71 Posted July 19, 2014 Author Share Posted July 19, 2014 Anyone else feel an Arnold vibe with this theme? The headline bed in particular. woah - what??? In relationship to what package mind you? I'm not familiar with his pre mid 90s collection. If anything someone might had been inspired of his music, since he treated the flagship markets as non existent until the last few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ntropolis 593 Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 woah - what??? In relationship to what package mind you? I'm not familiar with his pre mid 90s collection. If anything someone might had been inspired of his music, since he treated the flagship markets as non existent until the last few years. I can't quite pinpoint what theme exactly... maybe some cuts of Signature or News Edge? Like WBAL... Or KENS: I'm not musically inclined, so I can't explain what I'm hearing. It sort of sounds like a ticker in the background. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbs2newengland 71 Posted July 19, 2014 Author Share Posted July 19, 2014 I can't quite pinpoint what theme exactly... maybe some cuts of Signature or News Edge? Like WBAL... Or KENS: I'm not musically inclined, so I can't explain what I'm hearing. It sort of sounds like a ticker in the background. I can hear some similarities to the WBAL cut. I don't know if this was a package (I'm betting not or it's a production music), this was around the time in the 90s where talent opens weren't fashionable (or at least included in the main open for that matter.) KNBC ran long credits at that time, but all of them I've seen were other forms of music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
promoguy98 252 Posted July 20, 2014 Share Posted July 20, 2014 I can't quite pinpoint what theme exactly... maybe some cuts of Signature or News Edge? Like WBAL... Or KENS: I'm not musically inclined, so I can't explain what I'm hearing. It sort of sounds like a ticker in the background. That ticker sound is very Arnold-esque... It is one of several sounds that came pre-programmed in the Korg Wavestation Rompler-Synth, which all can be edited. I have the software version of Wavestation, which is identical to the hardware version, except that the quality is higher at the average standard of 44.1khz and 16bit. It's a beast to program, but that ticker sound can be heard in Arnold's stuff (The first 4 signature CD's are especially loaded with Wavestation-backed cuts, same with News Edge where it was extensively used. It's featured in a handful of 615 tracks, and several Gari packages (think The One and Only original series,etc. ) To me, that makes it super hard to tell where that track could have come from at first glance. I'll throw some quick examples up in the dropbox. Click on the link in my signature and look for "wavestation examples" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samantha 2878 Posted July 20, 2014 Share Posted July 20, 2014 Don't ask me why but I'm reminded of KTTV's 1992 theme from Gary Scott... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbs2newengland 71 Posted July 20, 2014 Author Share Posted July 20, 2014 The other thing about this is there isn't any other clips to base this on. No videos on YT featuring bumpers or closes and afternoon events from the 1994 Northridge quake have been disappeared. There was a video that was leading to the 4:00 or 5:00 open with the same theme, for the sake of saying. That ticker sound is very Arnold-esque... It is one of several sounds that came pre-programmed in the Korg Wavestation Rompler-Synth, which all can be edited. I have the software version of Wavestation, which is identical to the hardware version, except that the quality is higher at the average standard of 44.1khz and 16bit. It's a beast to program, but that ticker sound can be heard in Arnold's stuff (The first 4 signature CD's are especially loaded with Wavestation-backed cuts, same with News Edge where it was extensively used. It's featured in a handful of 615 tracks, and several Gari packages (think The One and Only original series,etc. ) To me, that makes it super hard to tell where that track could have come from at first glance. I'll throw some quick examples up in the dropbox. Click on the link in my signature and look for "wavestation examples" If this is true and all leads go to Stephen Arnold, then why I ask - they aren't using the NBC O&O Package today??? hahaha! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
promoguy98 252 Posted July 20, 2014 Share Posted July 20, 2014 The other thing about this is there isn't any other clips to base this on. No videos on YT featuring bumpers or closes and afternoon events from the 1994 Northridge quake have been disappeared. There was a video that was leading to the 4:00 or 5:00 open with the same theme, for the sake of saying. If this is true and all leads go to Stephen Arnold, then why I ask - they aren't using the NBC O&O Package today??? hahaha! That would be crazy if it were tied back to him, usually it would have been on one of his composite 'national' non-syndicated demos back then, but then again his custom theme for LIVE 5 in Charleston was never put on any example demos. As far as how many top 10 clients SAM back then, obviously Dallas was his big one. Thanks to that Korg Wavestation synth (and the M1) getting around the block so much in the early 90's, it really makes it tough to narrow down without hearing other aspects that would naturally tip us off to a composer. Wonder if Michael Boyd could have had something to do with the 93 theme since he was responsible for the 94-98 package? In hearing some of his cuts, he has some of the same main gear as Gari and SAM. The big intro drums at the top of the open "want" to remind me of Gari - but they seem a little too hard hitting for Gari at the time... same for SAM. Maybe Raymie's idea is worth a look into as well. This KNBC open theme is a great one, but proving to be a darn headscratcher! After hearing it again with fresh ears today, the intro drums somewhat remind me of the Gari-esque "One and Only" drum sounds from series one (think close intros and main ID's). Not 100% exactly, but in that same realm and style. I don't know what drum machine or synth the drum sound came from, but 1993 did just happen to be the same year that "The One and Only" made it's huge debut with it's spacy, futuristic drum intro sounds that got cross-pollinated into a dozen other Gari themes, so there's that idea..... I would almost lean towards Gari than Arnold for the moment. IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbs2newengland 71 Posted July 20, 2014 Author Share Posted July 20, 2014 That would be crazy if it were tied back to him, usually it would have been on one of his composite 'national' non-syndicated demos back then, but then again his custom theme for LIVE 5 in Charleston was never put on any example demos. As far as how many top 10 clients SAM back then, obviously Dallas was his big one. Thanks to that Korg Wavestation synth (and the M1) getting around the block so much in the early 90's, it really makes it tough to narrow down without hearing other aspects that would naturally tip us off to a composer. Wonder if Michael Boyd could have had something to do with the 93 theme since he was responsible for the 94-98 package? In hearing some of his cuts, he has some of the same main gear as Gari and SAM. The big intro drums at the top of the open "want" to remind me of Gari - but they seem a little too hard hitting for Gari at the time... same for SAM. Maybe Raymie's idea is worth a look into as well. This KNBC open theme is a great one, but proving to be a darn headscratcher! It sure seems to be a darn headscratcher! I'm surprised that Mr. SouthernMedia hasn't put this into the KNBC listing, I've heard this theme a while back, and its been on YouTube in some way for years now! OTTH: I didn't think technology would be the reason to point to a specific composer. Styles and signature sounds I thought would point to someone. I've been mistaken by themes between Frank Gari and Jerome Gilmer, but I thought it was influence in the sound, but not the technology behind it. Now there is crew of people who make news music and not just one man band doing it (at least from what I know) and of course its all virtualized, like no one has every known instrument in the world in at the various firms! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
promoguy98 252 Posted July 20, 2014 Share Posted July 20, 2014 It sure seems to be a darn headscratcher! I'm surprised that Mr. SouthernMedia hasn't put this into the KNBC listing, I've heard this theme a while back, and its been on YouTube in some way for years now! OTTH: I didn't think technology would be the reason to point to a specific composer. Styles and signature sounds I thought would point to someone. I've been mistaken by themes between Frank Gari and Jerome Gilmer, but I thought it was influence in the sound, but not the technology behind it. Now there is crew of people who make news music and not just one man band doing it (at least from what I know) and of course its all virtualized, like no one has every known instrument in the world in at the various firms! Yeah I've been mistaken too between Gilmer and Gari, especially with the use of bells/chimes at times. Now they seem to be all the rage... ie: This is Home. LOL Sometimes it's so darn easy to narrow down to a composer or two due to a somewhat consistent styling that they have, but then when those darn presets get used (with very little editing or tweaking) that seems to throw us all a few curveballs I suppose. But totally agree over the virtualized aspect... with so much moving to plugins such as Native Instruments, Omnisphere, East/West Composers Collection and virtual guitar collections like "Ministry of Rock 2" a lot of the sounds now tend to start meshing up together. Unless the composer has a very distinct/unique style that gets worked into a majority of their work, then it's probably easier than ever to blend in and sound just like everyone else. Crazy thing is, it's reached a point technically where one person can pretty much pull off a full, realistic station package with a combination of virtual instruments, synths and can even get live horns or strings overdubbed remotely through a third party studio, if they needed to and without ever having to set foot in their door. Fascinating times for music production for sure, but incredibly important for composers to make sure and keep their unique style and approach in the process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leavellebrett 85 Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 I can't quite pinpoint what theme exactly... maybe some cuts of Signature or News Edge? Like WBAL... Or KENS: I'm not musically inclined, so I can't explain what I'm hearing. It sort of sounds like a ticker in the background. Sorry for jumping in late. I totally hear exactly what you mean. Arnold's 80s and 90s repertoire has very percussive cuts. Lots of bleeps and bloops and clippity-cloppity types of stuff in the background. (All three of those terms are extremely musical, you know.) I was thinking something like Wall To Wall News or Third Coast (listen to the overall sample at 1:51) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MusicLaw 0 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 I can't quite pinpoint what theme exactly... maybe some cuts of Signature or News Edge? Like WBAL... Or KENS: I'm not musically inclined, so I can't explain what I'm hearing. It sort of sounds like a ticker in the background. The WBAL theme is entitled "Working For Baltimore." It's one of Gari's and is a predecessor to "Hearst A" package. The KENS theme I'm not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leavellebrett 85 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 The WBAL theme is entitled "Working For Baltimore." It's one of Gari's and is a predecessor to "Hearst A" package. The KENS theme I'm not sure. What? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ntropolis 593 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 The WBAL theme is entitled "Working For Baltimore." It's one of Gari's and is a predecessor to "Hearst A" package. The KENS theme I'm not sure. That WBAL theme was made for WBTV in Charlotte back in 1990. Anyway, that's interesting info about the Wavestation synth! I feel like all the themes in One World are based off of it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
promoguy98 252 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 That WBAL theme was made for WBTV in Charlotte back in 1990. Anyway, that's interesting info about the Wavestation synth! I feel like all the themes in One World are based off of it... Right probably so Ntropolis and I forgot to add it there Global Village!! That was one massive wavestation production with most likely some roland d-550/kurzweil k2000 synths sprinkled in, considering those were some of his main synth collection pieces. With One World you might also add in the Korg Triton if he bought that synth right when it was released. Back to the KNBC 1993 theme, the use of synth presets make it a bit hard to narrow down the composer. I haven't dug through the ASCAP/BMI listings yet, simply because there would be probably too many listings and unknowns to sort through. I'll go out on a limb with a couple of guesses and say either Gari or Michael Boyd who had composed the 94-98 theme, just to add to some of the other guesses in the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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