WFXT new graphics

[cbs2newengland 71]

Before Fox forced them to give it up KTVU was probably the highest rated Fox station in the country. Their newscasts regularly beat their O&O competitors and they were the number 2 station in terms of revenue in the market (they may have even been #1 in terms of revenue, memory is fuzzy).

 

So this theory that "COX and FOX don't work" is plain nonsense. Is the logo ugly? Yes. However viewers don't watch a station based on it's logo (if that was the case WCSC would be rated dead last), they watch based off of the content produced. Cox has a history of making stations market leaders and I suspect that they will make WFXT a force to be reckoned with.

 

For Christ Sakes Alive, it WILL NOT WORK IN BOSTON OR CENTRAL NEW ENGLAND. It's not about the damn logo (which just adds salt to the wounds.) In fact I lied, the logo does have a lot to do with it. Would you watch an anchor that dressed like as slob or came on air with beard? Graphics are like on air looks for the 10s, IMHO.

 

Whatever worked for Cox is relevant any other market than Central New England or Boston. They are coming in with a stupid wrecking ball and destroying everything that made this station unique, while remaining a corporate look and feel.

 

Just go onto the Boston Herald, or Globe's comment page or just google WFXT as a news search, and there is an overwhelming hatred to CMG and their treatment to WFXT.

 

I tried to warn this board exactly a year ago and all of yous were stuck on the Cox's talking points.

 

I do hear "an 'I told you so' coming"

[cbs2newengland 71]

And if I recall, there was a point earlier in the year where WFXT was actually leading in the ratings at 10pm and 11pm (although short lived) so Cox has the potential to make WFXT very successful. I do agree that the logo and some of their staffing moves have been very dumb. But the graphics do work and would look fine even if they stuck with the old logo like what WHBQ ended up doing.

 

And how can you ruin something that was in 3rd or 4th place anyways?

 

Remember the big blizzard that ate Boston? Don't forget American Idol (which is very popular in this area)... that should've had some asterisk to it. I don't think those ratings can sustain itself.

 

How you can ruin a 4th place station? Simple, WFXT had a niche audience. Cox is making the news so damn generic and so robotic (similar to the competing stations.) What is so offensive to Raponi, Rosenthal et al about having viewers be loyal to the anchors and talent and the talent loving their fans back? Why be the same if all the other stations are doing the same generic reports, over and over?

 

Whatever should stay in SFO should stay in SFO. We don't need their crap in this market. To steal the CBS O&O tag, I "Expect More"

[cbs2newengland 71]

Forgive me if I am repeating anything that has already been said, I stopped reading this thread because a lot of it is uninformed, inane BS as usual.

 

Everyone needs to settle down, it's just a logo. Lots of stations have bad logos, it doesn't make it a bad station. Chalk it up to an inexperienced graphics department and station management that is indifferent to design. They don't know any better and CMG doesn't really have a great track record of corporate marketing leadership. They recycle a lot of ideas and phrases between stations that have been researched and tested to death, but it doesn't get much deeper than that when it comes to cosmetics. Same deal in Jacksonville. They blew up talent and focused on content. Who cares about the design? Same deal in Tulsa -- they did another copy/paste job, taking KTVU management and ideas and running with that gameplan (and another poorly designed logo and another discounted Hothaus package from another Cox property).

 

It's kinda funny in a way, the new look of WFXT reminds me a bit of every time you see a fake TV station in a movie, with a very basic, poorly designed logo and a newscast open with massive type.

 

Bottom line: don't read too much into it. Don't expect a branding change that would phase out the network, don't expect it to become an NBC affiliate... or whatever other conspiracy theory is floating out there. Chalk it up to inexperience and indifference to design.

 

Sorry, I should've put all 3 onto one post.

 

This is the example of how I can't talk to people who dilute, talk down, downplay the truth. "It's just a logo"

 

It's a bad branding in a Top 8 market running amok. People should have a right to their opinion, and if they are beyond a little disappointed, then so be it. I'm tired of the other people here downplaying "it's just little things to small number", "it's a logo", its "inside baseball" many people place on this site. Aren't we the "small number" who cares about "it's a logo" that knows "inside baseball"? Should we have a right to be extremely disappointed?

[ToriElectra 291]

What I'm wondering is how they'll renovate their newsroom- it's filled with metal Fox 25 logos from before the O&O package, from what I've seen, and they run the entire perimeter of the place.

[atlnews2 557]

For Christ Sakes Alive, it WILL NOT WORK IN BOSTON OR CENTRAL NEW ENGLAND. It's not about the damn logo (which just adds salt to the wounds.) In fact I lied, the logo does have a lot to do with it. Would you watch an anchor that dressed like as slob or came on air with beard? Graphics are like on air looks for the 10s, IMHO.

 

Whatever worked for Cox is relevant any other market than Central New England or Boston. They are coming in with a stupid wrecking ball and destroying everything that made this station unique, while remaining a corporate look and feel.

 

Just go onto the Boston Herald, or Globe's comment page or just google WFXT as a news search, and there is an overwhelming hatred to CMG and their treatment to WFXT.

 

I tried to warn this board exactly a year ago and all of yous were stuck on the Cox's talking points.

 

I do hear "an 'I told you so' coming"

 

You have an irrational hatred of Cox.

[cbs2newengland 71]

What I'm wondering is how they'll renovate their newsroom- it's filled with metal Fox 25 logos from before the O&O package, from what I've seen, and they run the entire perimeter of the place.

 

I bet they'll build a studio all with 4 walls and a studio door because a "newsplex" and a window to their core audience (Mass 128) is just not cool to them.

 

You have an irrational hatred of Cox.

 

That's name calling. And I will refuse to go further until you read all the comments on social media about everyone saying "the reason I watched was that you were different" type of replies. Then we can talk.

[News 9 Viewer 100]

You have an irrational hatred of Cox.

 

That's name calling. And I will refuse to go further until you read all the comments on social media about everyone saying "the reason I watched was that you were different" type of replies. Then we can talk.

 

How many of those comments were written by you?

 

Pardon my French, but you are fucking crazy.

[cbs2newengland 71]

How many of those comments were written by you?

 

Pardon my French, but you are fucking crazy.

 

Then tell everyone else on the interwebz they are crazy because I can't manage 100+ fake Facebook and Disqus accounts, and other social media platforms! Pretty low to shoot me because all I am doing is quoting everyone else that seems to share 98% of the same narrative, no real people likes the new Fox 25 News.

[ProButtonPusher 230]

Then tell everyone else on the interwebz they are crazy because I can't manage 100+ fake Facebook and Disqus accounts, and other social media platforms! Pretty low to shoot me because all I am doing is quoting everyone else that seems to share 98% of the same narrative, no real people likes the new Fox 25 News.

I don't think most people here our fans, but I don't see anyone else having a meltdown over it.

 

At the end of the day, it's just a logo/re-brand of a TV station. Sometimes you have to just shrug and realize there are are many more important things to get worked-up about. Shit happens, can't get everything you want.

 

I expect you to quote this and complain about how we aren't taking this seriously, but I can at least say that I tried to rationalize all of this for you.

[cbs2newengland 71]

I don't think most people here our fans, but I don't see anyone else having a meltdown over it.

 

At the end of the day, it's just a logo/re-brand of a TV station. Sometimes you have to just shrug and realize there are are many more important things to get worked-up about. Shit happens, can't get everything you want.

 

I expect you to quote this and complain about how we aren't taking this seriously, but I can at least say that I tried to rationalize all of this for you.

 

It's not just the graphics or bugs, it is the identity and makeup of the station that these carpetbaggers have no idea what they are doing to the market. New England is very personality driven so taking the personality out and creating generic graphics from some generic market will not sell. (another reoccuring discussion elsewhere on the Webz.)

 

I guess TVNT is not the right site for me because discussing personalities and news content is outside of the scope. But I should shoot myself because I'm the messenger and I'm better off that way than having someone else do it.

[NewEnglandOne 17]

I bet they'll build a studio all with 4 walls and a studio door because a "newsplex" and a window to their core audience (Mass 128) is just not cool to them.

 

 

 

That's name calling. And I will refuse to go further until you read all the comments on social media about everyone saying "the reason I watched was that you were different" type of replies. Then we can talk.

 

I have to agree with cbs2newengland on the sentiment of the post, and about the comments on the changes on social media. Being that I follow this closely, I've seen the vast amount of viewer complaints on Facebook and Twitter. Each time I do a story, I read all the comments... The vast majority of them are negative. Viewers tend not to like change, but the "outrage" on the new logo and graphics has a lot more then that behind it. It's seen as the uniqueness of the station being completely taken away. When they announced the change of the logo on their Facebook page with the new logo as their profile picture, the comments were overwhelmingly negative.

 

Some people do like the change, and the turn to more hard news. But overall, viewers are not happy with what Cox has done to this station. It does not mean that Cox is a bad company, or that they are ruining the station. It just means that what typically works for them may just not work for them in Boston, and maybe they need a new approach. Just look at WBZ and what happened when they were re-branded to "CBS4".

 

The numbers don't lie, and their 10pm news is the only newscast where they have been strong... and that number keeps going down. If we look at 6pm in p2+, they are #4 with 28k viewers, WCVB is #1 with 186k.

 

If you don't keep your viewers happy, they are going to tune in elsewhere.

[mardek1995 200]

I have to agree with cbs2newengland on the sentiment of the post, and about the comments on the changes on social media. Being that I follow this closely, I've seen the vast amount of viewer complaints on Facebook and Twitter. Each time I do a story, I read all the comments... The vast majority of them are negative. Viewers tend not to like change, but the "outrage" on the new logo and graphics has a lot more then that behind it. It's seen as the uniqueness of the station being completely taken away. When they announced the change of the logo on their Facebook page with the new logo as their profile picture, the comments were overwhelmingly negative.

 

Some people do like the change, and the turn to more hard news. But overall, viewers are not happy with what Cox has done to this station. It does not mean that Cox is a bad company, or that they are ruining the station. It just means that what typically works for them may just not work for them in Boston, and maybe they need a new approach. Just look at WBZ and what happened when they were re-branded to "CBS4".

 

The numbers don't lie, and their 10pm news is the only newscast where they have been strong... and that number keeps going down. If we look at 6pm in p2+, they are #4 with 28k viewers, WCVB is #1 with 186k.

 

If you don't keep your viewers happy, they are going to tune in elsewhere.

WHBQ has a better logo and graphics than WFXT does, and I'm thinking it's more likely to be the market leader within a year or two, or maybe even sooner.

[Guest]

uninformed speculation

 

Someone needs to tell me what is so "special" about New England that makes it impossible for a hard news format to work?

Here's something kind of crazy: WCVB has the exact same format. In fact, every Hearst station does. It's another "one size fits all" company. They all cover the overnight shootings, house fires, traffic, heavy on weather, light on chit chat (but still some chit chat), politics, financial, news. Look at a Hearst newscast next to a Cox newscast and they're pretty similar.

 

You want to tell me that Boston is a personality-driven market? That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Local news as a whole is personality driven -- that's kind of the whole point. People care just as much about the on air talent in Minneapolis, or Sacramento, or Chicago as they do in Boston.

 

You want to talk about social media reaction to a logo? The majority of folks only come online to complain. You really think someone is going to take time out of their day to compliment a new logo? Probably not. Look at any business on social media. They aren't spending their day responding to polite messages from people who love their product.

 

Didn't we just see this at KTVU? They made a few changes, ratings fluctuated and stabilized. They luckily had the padding for that fluctuation in the numbers so it didn't get written about as much as expected. The Boston news market is a little more competitive, so ratings spikes and drops are scrutinized a little more closely.

 

Cox owns stations in the south, the midwest, the northeast... and a great majority are incredibly successful. They know what they're doing... more than some kid on some website, if you can believe it. So don't you worry, sleep easy... everything's going to be okay at FOX25.

[Mrtraveler01 737]

How you can ruin a 4th place station? Simple, WFXT had a niche audience.

 

No offense, but that doesn't mean a damn thing if it only remains a niche audience. Niche audiences do not equate to valuable ad space which is really the only thing stations care about.

 

I have to agree with cbs2newengland on the sentiment of the post, and about the comments on the changes on social media. Being that I follow this closely, I've seen the vast amount of viewer complaints on Facebook and Twitter. Each time I do a story, I read all the comments... The vast majority of them are negative. Viewers tend not to like change, but the "outrage" on the new logo and graphics has a lot more then that behind it. It's seen as the uniqueness of the station being completely taken away. When they announced the change of the logo on their Facebook page with the new logo as their profile picture, the comments were overwhelmingly negative.

 

Some people do like the change, and the turn to more hard news. But overall, viewers are not happy with what Cox has done to this station. It does not mean that Cox is a bad company, or that they are ruining the station. It just means that what typically works for them may just not work for them in Boston, and maybe they need a new approach. Just look at WBZ and what happened when they were re-branded to "CBS4".

 

The numbers don't lie, and their 10pm news is the only newscast where they have been strong... and that number keeps going down. If we look at 6pm in p2+, they are #4 with 28k viewers, WCVB is #1 with 186k.

 

If you don't keep your viewers happy, they are going to tune in elsewhere.

 

This is a much more rational and less emotionally charged post. But as other have said, basing it off of comments online is a bad metric to use because no matter the change, people will go online to complain about it and few people who actually like it will take the effort to make that comment online.

 

However basing it off of ratings is a much better indicator and it does seem like WFXT is slipping in the ratings, but granted they were in 4th place when Cox bought them so like I said before, they really had nowhere else to go but up even when you factor in the "niche audience".

[SterlingNorth 33]

Just looking at the logo, as I just discovered it, it looks sloppy. Why doesn't the 25 or "News" fit within the fields. Why does the 25 vary so drastically in size compared to the blue box? (The bottom of the 2 and the entire side of the 5 stick way out of the blue box in the opens, but is only just barely too large in the bug as illustrated in the first post.) Why did they not use the FOX wordmark? Why is FOX left-justified, leaving it to look unbalanced? (The theory that they started off using the call letters instead may explain it.)

[cbs2newengland 71]

Someone needs to tell me what is so "special" about New England that makes it impossible for a hard news format to work?

Here's something kind of crazy: WCVB has the exact same format. In fact, every Hearst station does. It's another "one size fits all" company. They all cover the overnight shootings, house fires, traffic, heavy on weather, light on chit chat (but still some chit chat), politics, financial, news. Look at a Hearst newscast next to a Cox newscast and they're pretty similar.

 

You want to tell me that Boston is a personality-driven market? That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Local news as a whole is personality driven -- that's kind of the whole point. People care just as much about the on air talent in Minneapolis, or Sacramento, or Chicago as they do in Boston.

 

You want to talk about social media reaction to a logo? The majority of folks only come online to complain. You really think someone is going to take time out of their day to compliment a new logo? Probably not. Look at any business on social media. They aren't spending their day responding to polite messages from people who love their product.

 

Didn't we just see this at KTVU? They made a few changes, ratings fluctuated and stabilized. They luckily had the padding for that fluctuation in the numbers so it didn't get written about as much as expected. The Boston news market is a little more competitive, so ratings spikes and drops are scrutinized a little more closely.

 

Cox owns stations in the south, the midwest, the northeast... and a great majority are incredibly successful. They know what they're doing... more than some kid on some website, if you can believe it. So don't you worry, sleep easy... everything's going to be okay at FOX25.

 

Boston (err CENTRAL NEW ENGLAND) is a very heavily suburban market. I will refuse to repeat myself and suggest you look in the thread of the trade to see what I mean. WCVB, WBZ, WHDH and WMUR all do the same stories, car wrecks, house fires, Creep of the Day™, etc. Why should a station do something the others do? Why is there an obligation of a station that is required to do everything the same like everyone else?

 

People need to understand the New Fox 25 News is so goddamn generic, you can't tell from a 9am to a 5:00 pm newscast apart. They have some angry looking anchors who don't really care about the communities they cover. They could care less if someone responds on Twitter, they'll just give you a canned response. I know WFXT's own Fb page is all about canned responses.

 

The problem is many people here on TVNT just seem to agree with everyone else and "follow the leader" and believe that cookie-cutters work.

 

And you think people go online and just complain? As New England One has already debunked that. I'll refrain from that point. I disagree on the CBS 4 thing, partially because WBZ kinda thought they were the chosen station many years back and decided to merge radio and TV newsrooms which only worked well if you had a badge to the station. It was in the last years as a Group W station where they overemphasized the WBZ calls in the news brand. And to be quite honest, WBZ means nothing to me because I don't understand the history of a radio station that never went to all news. They could've killed WEEI much earlier on because of their signal, but I guess they were so special, they could do things above corporate mandates. That's another discussion.

 

The CBS 4 experiment vs. the De-Foxization because of affiliation requirements by Fox that have to show them as a Fox affiliate.

 

No offense, but that doesn't mean a damn thing if it only remains a niche audience. Niche audiences do not equate to valuable ad space which is really the only thing stations care about.

 

What ad space? What money? WFXT is like worth $200 million plus. Money over ratings, talk about some fat cats from Wall Street who want more cash to spend at other stations!

 

Another thing WFXT did was had an aggressive investigative unit. A nutcracker of an operation lead by Mike Beaudet, whose now replaced by a Cox carpetbagger who claims to be from around here but worked at one of their stations.

 

Oh and VB wasn't a local Mark Hyman, despite what some here or even Cox management wants you to believe. He wasn't just an opinion maker, but he was a GREAT interviewer. Asked people hard questions. To quote his Herald column "When was the last time you saw a live interview with Marty Walsh?" Notice the word "live".

 

That Beacon Hill Studio was perfect to get the Democrat Speaker of the House to come on to WFXT's air to speak about the latest vote on the hot-button issue. It wouldn't take no less than 5 minutes to go across the street and do a live interview. Does any other station do this? Nope because they think they know what's best for their marketplace. And Fox 25 for (the most part) followed the O&O mandates (although the set wasn't but again it was a $10m project.) And is there a market for local politicos? Hell yeah!

 

I guess I am to emotionally connected to have an opinion. I guess I'm the messenger everyone hates so I'll go and shoot myself and never come here again since everyone here think's I'm the devil's child.

 

Not kidding. I'm done with you!

[atlnews2 557]

Someone needs to tell me what is so "special" about New England that makes it impossible for a hard news format to work?

Here's something kind of crazy: WCVB has the exact same format. In fact, every Hearst station does. It's another "one size fits all" company. They all cover the overnight shootings, house fires, traffic, heavy on weather, light on chit chat (but still some chit chat), politics, financial, news. Look at a Hearst newscast next to a Cox newscast and they're pretty similar.

 

You want to tell me that Boston is a personality-driven market? That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Local news as a whole is personality driven -- that's kind of the whole point. People care just as much about the on air talent in Minneapolis, or Sacramento, or Chicago as they do in Boston.

 

You want to talk about social media reaction to a logo? The majority of folks only come online to complain. You really think someone is going to take time out of their day to compliment a new logo? Probably not. Look at any business on social media. They aren't spending their day responding to polite messages from people who love their product.

 

Didn't we just see this at KTVU? They made a few changes, ratings fluctuated and stabilized. They luckily had the padding for that fluctuation in the numbers so it didn't get written about as much as expected. The Boston news market is a little more competitive, so ratings spikes and drops are scrutinized a little more closely.

 

Cox owns stations in the south, the midwest, the northeast... and a great majority are incredibly successful. They know what they're doing... more than some kid on some website, if you can believe it. So don't you worry, sleep easy... everything's going to be okay at FOX25.

 

THANK YOU.

 

I don't get how people are saying that WFXT was special in someway. The only thing unique about it is their set. Other than that it was a generic Fox O&O with generic O&O graphics, a generic product, and a generic O&O logo. People complaining about "carpetbaggers" need to realize that people in this industry move around. Every personality isn't going to be a local. Also there is nothing unique about Boston. This narrative that it's unique because it's "heavily suburbanized" is nonsense. There are countless markets that are nothing but urban sprawl. Finally this "they served a niche" is also nonsense. A broadcaster isn't in the business to serve a niche, they're in the the business to compete. The station was 3rd place at best, but most of the time was dead last. The only niche they served was being the station that ad buyers went to when they couldn't afford WCVB rates.

[swillh2k2 203]

[quote name='cbs2newengland'] I guess I am to emotionally connected to have an opinion. [B]I guess I'm the messenger everyone hates so I'll go and shoot myself and never come here again since everyone here think's I'm the devil's child.[/B] Not kidding. I'm done with you![/QUOTE] I hate to take this off topic, but statements like that seriously scare me. @cbs2newengland, I hope that you realize that your opinion is welcome here anytime. But you need to realize that what you just said, especially in the realm of a message board like this, is quite disturbing. You've threatened to "shoot yourself" not once, but twice, all because individuals (who have a right to do so) disagreed with your opinion (which you and everyone else have a right to). Whenever someone disagrees with you and pushes back on your opinion (which, again, you have a right to), you throw a tantrum and leave in a huff with statements like "I'm never coming back" or "I'll go and shoot myself." While I hope you stay, maybe it [B]is[/B] time you stepped away - maybe for your own well-being. And I'm saying that seriously, not out of dislike, but out of genuine concern.

[atlnews2 557]

[quote name='swillh2k2']I hate to take this off topic, but statements like that seriously scare me. @cbs2newengland, I hope that you realize that your opinion is welcome here anytime. But you need to realize that what you just said, especially in the realm of a message board like this, is quite disturbing. You've threatened to "shoot yourself" not once, but twice, all because individuals (who have a right to do so) disagreed with your opinion (which you and everyone else have a right to). Whenever someone disagrees with you and pushes back on your opinion (which, again, you have a right to), you throw a tantrum and leave in a huff with statements like "I'm never coming back" or "I'll go and shoot myself." While I hope you stay, maybe it [B]is[/B] time you stepped away - maybe for your own well-being. And I'm saying that seriously, not out of dislike, but out of genuine concern.[/QUOTE] He sent me this message saying that he was going to kill himself and have the police come to my door. [MEDIA=imgur]KiwgsmE[/MEDIA] And for the record I am not a Cox employee, nor have I ever worked for a Cox affiliated company.

[jbnews 344]

Well, I think Cox ruined the flare that FOX 25 had.

[NewEnglandOne 17]

Someone needs to tell me what is so "special" about New England that makes it impossible for a hard news format to work?

 

I don't think it has much to do with "hard news" as it does with completely changing the format of the station. As an anchor told me, it's not like they weren't doing hard news before, it was in a different format... and it's not as if they were covering cat weddings. Cox has done some great things with the station, like the amount of resources that have been added. They operated a "bare bones" news operation when owned by Fox.

 

I don't get how people are saying that WFXT was special in someway. The only thing unique about it is their set. Other than that it was a generic Fox O&O with generic O&O graphics, a generic product, and a generic O&O logo.

 

Their newsroom set really isn't unique anyways, WHDH has had a newsroom set for a long time - the only difference is that FOX25 has windows. What made them somewhat unique was their morning show, and their 5pm newscast. The morning show was more conversational, personality driven, and entertaining. The morning show is 6 hours long, and it went from what it was to pretty much 30 minute news blocks on repeat which now makes it pretty boring.

 

The 5pm newscast was unique in that it was an hour of long form reporting, social media interaction, and live in-studio interviews. They billed it as digging deeper into the stories of the day. All of that went away with Cox (and is what ultimately drove Maria Stephanos from the station.)

 

In my opinion, instead of the 180 degrees of change mandated by corporate based on what works in other markets, they should have evaluated what would work in the Boston market. They could have taken the FOX format and tweaked it into something Cox would be proud of.

 

As former FOX25 commentator Doug "VB" Goudie said, the station was different, and now that's gone.

 

In an article he wrote for the Boston Herald about Stephanos leaving the station, he ended with this: "We were different. It doesn't mean we were better — sometimes our ratings proved that — and it doesn't mean we were always right (perhaps I didn't need to be live wearing a Speedo that time), but we were different. And as I watched Maria Stephanos' farewell last night on Fox 25, I couldn't help but feel that as she was leaving that building, "different" was leaving the Boston TV news market, at least for now."

 

That's why this logo change is seen as a lot more than just a logo change.

[Weeters 1811]

This thread has gone pretty far off the rails and has devolved into personal attacks. Thus it must be taken out behind the woodshed and put out of it's misery. RIP. If there are any further developments with WFXT, feel free to create a new thread (and please try to be rational about it...) And for the record, @cbs2newengland is on indefinite time-out. :smash: