C Block 1488 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 If I had put money on “Who’s the next to get busted” it probably would have been Lauer. I could have made a fortune!! We actually did have a pool going here. Everyone picked four names. I verbally mused about Matt Lauer but ultimately didn't pick him when we locked in our responses. My thinking was that two morning anchors wouldn't go down at the same time. Now I can't cash in! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daybreak 269 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Did they do the normal opening this morning with the announcer “This is Today with Savannah Guthrie” without saying Matt name in the opening? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wabceyewitness 767 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Did they do the normal opening this morning with the announcer “This is Today with Savannah Guthrie” without saying Matt name in the opening? The open didn't mention any names. It just said "This is TODAY... Live from Studio 1A in Rockefeller Plaza" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgie56 3066 Posted November 29, 2017 Author Share Posted November 29, 2017 Criticizing his colleagues' responses is silly. They said nothing against the victim. Very few issues in life are simple black and white. You don't tell people how to cope. anti-anti-Lauer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eat News 4738 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 I'm getting the feeling that we should be worried about every News Outlet! What's next ABC?!?! CNN?!?!?!?!? CNBC/MSNBC!?!?!? BBC even?!!?!?!? Draining the swamp includes the biased and uncouth members of the old media. After year and years of this ...the floodgates are open. Boatloads of cash saved by firing naughty journo's...and evening out the playing field. History tells us... Men with lots of money, and unchecked power WILL take liberties with vulnerable men and women. This has not yet-trickled down to the "local" level yet...and it may never reach there because of fear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wabceyewitness 767 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Anyone else think Savannah's and Kathie Lee's responses were more sympathetic to Lauer than to the victim? I get it, we are all human and can be genuinely good people and make mistakes, and maybe Matt fits the bill, but he is not the victim here. I felt the same way, especially compared to how Gayle & Norah broke the news of Charlie Rose's then-suspension from CBS. I don't think it's a fair comparison. Norah and Gayle had 12+ hours to process the news of Charlie's suspension. Savannah and Gayle, while they knew of the rumors and potential forthcoming reports, were told just before dawn that their friend and colleague was fired, effective immediately. They were given the official NBC statement moments before going on air. That said, I think they handled it incredibly well and as best as they could. They did show compassion for the victim and acknowledged her braveness while balancing it with the very real emotion of learning that someone you have known for years has engaged in such awful behavior. I guess it is very easy to be critical of a situation when you are not part of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianpr3 173 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 I am very speechless and shocked about all this, i knew he had a reputation of being a dick but this.... i said it in jest that he would be next but woah.. i feel those accused should take a lie detector,on the off chance anyone accused is innocent(minus those who fessed up) they should sue those who accused them cause if you are accused dont you have the right to defend yourself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWUpdate 1290 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 I guess it is very easy to be critical of a situation when you are not part of it. Draining the swamp includes the biased and uncouth members of the old media. After year and years of this ...the floodgates are open. Boatloads of cash saved by firing naughty journo's...and evening out the playing field. History tells us... Men with lots of money, and unchecked power WILL take liberties with vulnerable men and women. Too bad this spirit of accountability doesn't extend to the most powerful man of all -- a man who built his life and (political) career by taking liberties with the vulnerable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty Muck 4168 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Anyone else think Savannah's and Kathie Lee's responses were more sympathetic to Lauer than to the victim? I get it, we are all human and can be genuinely good people and make mistakes, and maybe Matt fits the bill, but he is not the victim here. That can also be an aftereffect of being told that Matt was fired minutes before the show was to start. I have doubts that Savannah and Hota were of 100% sound judgement... they were obviously shocked and horrified at how this all came down. I'm giving them a pass. Others should, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eat News 4738 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 If I had put money on “Who’s the next to get busted” it probably would have been Lauer. I could have made a fortune!! Yeah... I have a couple hundred on Larry King...but the odds are against me now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidwestTV 1173 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Honestly, and I'm speaking generally, what disappoints me the most about these recent firings (Matt Lauer, Charlie Rose, etc) is the political ramifications. There is shock and awe, yes, but there's more political bickering between the left and right. It's a he-said-she said. It's "stoopid Libtards" and "idiot Republic**ts." The hypocrisy from the right is astounding. It's "deserved punishment"for the liberal MSM," but somehow the multiple situations that occurred at Fox News are forgiven, all lies, not as bad, and a liberal DNC ploy to destroy them. The "holier-than-thou" attitude from the left is appalling. It's "yeah, he might have done it and is a bad person for it, but they at least fired him almost right away and were already investigating him rather than shelling out tens of millions of dollars to keep the victims quiet for years, so therefore this organization is a better one." Forget the victims am I right? Who cares? They're just (well, not so much as before) nameless, faceless victims who are trying to cash a check, right? Let's not try to do anything about a culture thing. Let's not do anything to make sure that all people are treated fairly and with equity. Let's focus instead how this can further our own, selfish political agenda and rhetoric. You know who a silent (for lack of a better word) victim is through all of these firings? The younger generation. People like myself. Newcomers to the industry, those in school (be it college or high school) who aspire (or now aspired) to be the next Charlie Rose, Bill O'Reilly, Roger Ailes, Brian Williams, Matt Lauer, etc. They aspired to be the journalism juggernauts of their generation. They/We looked up to some of these legends. We trusted them, we believed in them, and they were our role models. Some have even worked under them in internships. All of that trust, all of that inspiration and aspiration, lost. Betrayed. Wiped away forever. Now, instead of watching people on TV and trying to learn from them (be it their strengths or weaknesses), we watch them and must wonder "Are you next? What have you done? Did you do anything? Will you crush my heart and soul too? If I can't anymore trust the people who I looked up to for literally years, if I can't anymore look up to my mentor, or role model, or journalism hero, then who can I?" That's what isn't being discussed, and for me, that's a problem that needs to be addressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfomspphl 453 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 TODAY used to have a really unique relationship with its past - celebrating and honoring it with the anniversary specials, bringing back old anchors, etc - something Bryant Gumbel instilled. It wore off with the 2017 anniversary lookback - you could tell the tradition was fading. Sadly, this pretty much kills that as Matt was the one who took the 'history' baton from Bryant Gumbel. Tough situation for everyone there. The bright side is they have the best bench as noted. I'd like Brian Williams but can understand that being a long shot. And Willie Geist may get his chance. Not to mention Hoda, Tamron back from the brink, Natalie, and... Megyn. Lots and lots of choices. Oh Billy Bush has a lot of new friends - he must be feeling a lot less alone. Who's ready to start a network with the castaways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ns8401 846 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 As you can tell I was in retirement from this forum let alone this thread for the past year and seeing this ordeal, and as I am shocked by fox2’s defense, in other words that’s practically code for enabling. Ummm... no... I’m afraid there’s nothing odd, uncommon, unusual or bizarre about somebody messing around with a coworker while stressed at work and in an unhappy marriage... you can add woefully naive to your shock... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RetroCirq 148 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Ummm... no... I’m afraid there’s nothing odd, uncommon, unusual or bizarre about somebody messing around with a coworker while stressed at work and in an unhappy marriage... Ergo...the consequences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ns8401 846 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Ergo...the consequences. But there aren’t always consequences and doing something between two consenting adults is not a crime... somebody had to say he violated them... “Matt and I had sex and it wasn’t very good... harassment!” Is the kind of thing I’m afraid we could start seeing. This is something that is easy to turn into a weapon in the blink of an eye... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eat News 4738 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Too bad this spirit of accountability doesn't extend to the most powerful man of all -- a man who built his life and (political) career by taking liberties with the vulnerable. But that seems to be the end game. I guess we shall see who survives...and why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyrannical bastard 3470 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 How long before the "non fake news" outlets start circling around the clearance aisle of disgraced on air people.... Give it a few months, and some company that owns too many TV stations will snatch him up... One company is controlled by a family who's CEO was involved with duplicating porn and himself was busted in a sex sting in a company vehicle... And the other is run by a college acquaintance who is dropping a lot of money at their Alma mater to name a student athlete center after him and his wife... What a world we live in... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ns8401 846 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 How long before the "non fake news" outlets start circling around the clearance aisle of disgraced on air people.... Give it a few months, and some company that owns too many TV stations will snatch him up... One company is controlled by a family who's CEO was involved with duplicating porn and himself was busted in a sex sting in a company vehicle... And the other is run by a college acquaintance who is dropping a lot of money at their Alma mater to name a student athlete center after him and his wife... What a world we live in... And we always have. We can just see it 24/7 in HD and we can personally record it live in HD now... where before it was simply word against word or never saw the light of day on a large scale... for the folks shocked that crazy things happen... I don’t know what to tell you... yes they do because you are dealing with imperfect beings... of course they are gonna be screwed up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevCor 344 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Honestly, and I'm speaking generally, what disappoints me the most about these recent firings (Matt Lauer, Charlie Rose, etc) is the political ramifications. There is shock and awe, yes, but there's more political bickering between the left and right. It's a he-said-she said. It's "stoopid Libtards" and "idiot Republic**ts." The hypocrisy from the right is astounding. It's "deserved punishment"for the liberal MSM," but somehow the multiple situations that occurred at Fox News are forgiven, all lies, not as bad, and a liberal DNC ploy to destroy them. The "holier-than-thou" attitude from the left is appalling. It's "yeah, he might have done it and is a bad person for it, but they at least fired him almost right away and were already investigating him rather than shelling out tens of millions of dollars to keep the victims quiet for years, so therefore this organization is a better one." Forget the victims am I right? Who cares? They're just (well, not so much as before) nameless, faceless victims who are trying to cash a check, right? Let's not try to do anything about a culture thing. Let's not do anything to make sure that all people are treated fairly and with equity. Let's focus instead how this can further our own, selfish political agenda and rhetoric. You know who a silent (for lack of a better word) victim is through all of these firings? The younger generation. People like myself. Newcomers to the industry, those in school (be it college or high school) who aspire (or now aspired) to be the next Charlie Rose, Bill O'Reilly, Roger Ailes, Brian Williams, Matt Lauer, etc. They aspired to be the journalism juggernauts of their generation. They/We looked up to some of these legends. We trusted them, we believed in them, and they were our role models. Some have even worked under them in internships. All of that trust, all of that inspiration and aspiration, lost. Betrayed. Wiped away forever. Now, instead of watching people on TV and trying to learn from them (be it their strengths or weaknesses), we watch them and must wonder "Are you next? What have you done? Did you do anything? Will you crush my heart and soul too? If I can't anymore trust the people who I looked up to for literally years, if I can't anymore look up to my mentor, or role model, or journalism hero, then who can I?" That's what isn't being discussed, and for me, that's a problem that needs to be addressed. I can assure you that that thought process of "Can you be trusted?" of some of our greater icons not only permeates the media industry, but EVERY industry that gets rocked by a scandal. Every generation gets hit with a culture-changing scandal of some sort, so it's not to be unexpected that the youngers who look up to the elders will always be skeptical. For example, when I was military, and sexual assault training became a thing because of the so called "buddy-rapes", we (the junior enlisted) were always skeptical of the senior enlisted or command level providing the training. Then you turn around, and senior brass are getting SACKED for the exact thing they told us not to do. I mean shit, the TOP Air Force Sexual Assault Prevention Officer was fired for sexual assault. So, I agree with your sentiment. But I think the bigger problem becomes that the cultures these men created are still going to exist unless they too are scrubbed of the enablers. (See FOX v Ailes and Shine) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RetroCirq 148 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 But there aren’t always consequences and doing something between two consenting adults is not a crime... somebody had to say he violated them... “Matt and I had sex and it wasn’t very good... harassment!” Is the kind of thing I’m afraid we could start seeing. This is something that is easy to turn into a weapon in the blink of an eye... Yes, but at the same time, we can't just use the "casting couch" angle and play Devil's Advocate to justify the argument. By that logic, you might argue that even if it was consensual, it argues that the predator had the upper hand and the prey is helpless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ns8401 846 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Yes, but at the same time, we can't just use the "casting couch" angle and play Devil's Advocate to justify the argument. By that logic, you might argue that even if it was consensual, it argues that the predator had the upper hand and the prey is helpless. Do you mind speaking non-cryptically... as currently written this is pretty irrelevant to the quoted post... I certainly never argued predator, prey, upper hand or helpless... You do appear to be arguing for unfettered firings though if anyone is ever accused... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RetroCirq 148 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Do you mind speaking non-cryptically... as currently written this is pretty irrelevant to the quoted post... I certainly never argued predator, prey, upper hand or helpless... You do appear to be arguing for unfettered firings though if anyone is ever accused... If you say so here it is: Here's what you said: "Ummm... no... I’m afraid there’s nothing odd, uncommon, unusual or bizarre about somebody messing around with a coworker while stressed at work and in an unhappy marriage..." I've pointed out that regardless of the backstory, there will be consequences for the actions. You've also mentioned this: "But there aren’t always consequences and doing something between two consenting adults is not a crime... somebody had to say he violated them... “Matt and I had sex and it wasn’t very good... harassment!” Is the kind of thing I’m afraid we could start seeing. This is something that is easy to turn into a weapon in the blink of an eye..." You might be right about the lack of consequences on some people's part, but the truth remains. In the post-Cosby, Weinstein, etc age, the risk of losing their jobs is great, (i.e. retaliation by their peers, etc). But deep down they know the ramifications of not dealing with the problem head-on. Yes, it was sad to see a man of great stature like Matt having 20 years at the network be swiped away, without having to deal with the facts. This is a crucial time, and some things cannot be swept under the rug to protect the brand or product, in this case, the Today Show or CBS This Morning. So, NS8401 let's deal with the issue right then and there: accountability is key, if we do not hold ourselves accountable for our actions, someone else will call us out. I get the fact that we now become driven by the court of public opinion vs. the court of law. A lot of us want to go with the idea that all suspects are "guilty until proven innocent" instead of "innocent until proven guilty". But why is that? Fear. A seasoned veteran whose career was built up versus a Production Assistant or Intern who hears and see things for what they are behind the scenes. The PA gets fired, the veteran remains at the company. But what happens when the same PA who knows something decided to risk it all, to share his/her feelings and therefore do some good? Could you answer that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianpr3 173 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 But there aren’t always consequences and doing something between two consenting adults is not a crime... somebody had to say he violated them... “Matt and I had sex and it wasn’t very good... harassment!” Is the kind of thing I’m afraid we could start seeing. This is something that is easy to turn into a weapon in the blink of an eye... ns is right what about the right to defen yourself if accused since it is off with a mans head now. I posted earlier what about the rights of the accused, what's next are men gonna have to make release forms so they avoid being falsely accused, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ns8401 846 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 If you say so here it is: Here's what you said: "Ummm... no... I’m afraid there’s nothing odd, uncommon, unusual or bizarre about somebody messing around with a coworker while stressed at work and in an unhappy marriage..." I've pointed out that regardless of the backstory, there will be consequences for the actions. You've also mentioned this: "But there aren’t always consequences and doing something between two consenting adults is not a crime... somebody had to say he violated them... “Matt and I had sex and it wasn’t very good... harassment!” Is the kind of thing I’m afraid we could start seeing. This is something that is easy to turn into a weapon in the blink of an eye..." You might be right about the lack of consequences on some people's part, but the truth remains. In the post-Cosby, Weinstein, etc age, the risk of losing their jobs is great, (i.e. retaliation by their peers, etc). But deep down they know the ramifications of not dealing with the problem head-on. Yes, it was sad to see a man of great stature like Matt having 20 years at the network be swiped away, without having to deal with the facts. This is a crucial time, and some things cannot be swept under the rug to protect the brand or product, in this case, the Today Show or CBS This Morning. So, NS8401 let's deal with the issue right then and there: accountability is key, if we do not hold ourselves accountable for our actions, someone else will call us out. So you can’t even deal with the facts now? Just lop their heads off and be done? Do tell... The problem is that you’ve just taken the human variable in the equation and dismissed it... I don’t really care if he’s famous or not and needs “accountability to a higher standard”... it’s a nice sentiment but expecting everyone to do that is foolish... these guys are no more immune to bad behavior than a guy on the line at GM or a entry level manager at a small company... It sounds to be like he pursued a further relationship after a consensual one that the other person had second thoughts about most likely... that is wrong on his part. But we MUST be careful to get all the facts before heads roll, especially when the court of public opinion is the jury as is usually the case though it wasn’t here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RetroCirq 148 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 So you can’t even deal with the facts now? Just lop their heads off and be done? Do tell... Define facts. Who's report to believe? You're basically saying that unless there is concrete evidence against the accuser, it's all hearsay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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