CircleSeven 1944 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 I just realized that no matter whether someone else thinks something will change or not you simply take the opposite position. He suggests they make keep it, you say "I hope so but this is Fox and they will". I say Scripps will obviously standardize WKBW including getting rid of MC whatever it is and you fight me and question how I know that and tell me it's not a sure thing. So you seem to do this stuff on purpose or perhaps don't understand that you do it. It's tough to discuss things with you because you simply say "that's my position and too bad". It's not really fun to watch someone rant and rave about changes, challenge them in an attempt to discuss their ideas and then be told too bad. I'm saying this in an attempt to get you to understand that discussing ideas is better than "I've stated my stance, go get a mop and clean it up" or whatever the catch-phrase of the week is. It's really aggravating to try to talk to you when you are that rigid and inflexible, if you want to be on a DISCUSSION forum, you should come prepared to DISCUSS. Well if you don't like what I say, than that's fine. That's your prerogative, that's how you feel. I'm just stating my stance, that's all. Take that for what it's worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ns8401 846 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Well if you don't like what I say, than that's fine. That's your prerogative, that's how you feel. I'm just stating my stance, that's all. Take that for what it's worth. Thank you for proving my point. No discussion, just you don't like it, that's your problem. What's with that? Could you perhaps discuss why that is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CircleSeven 1944 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Thank you for proving my point. No discussion, just you don't like it, that's your problem. What's with that? Could you perhaps discuss that? All I'm saying than that's your prerogative. And if you don't like what's being said, that's fine. I'm not here to cater to you. I'm just stating my stance like I've always done, whether you like it or not. I meant what I said, and I make no apologies. Take that for what it's worth. Going back on topic, I'm strongly for them to at least keep the Circle Lazer 2 logo, because that's their history. But if Fox get's rid of it (and sadly they'll probably going to do it), it would certainly hurt me, but we have to realize Fox has standardize, just like Scripps, and yes if Scripps follows through with getting rid of MCTYW with Inergy, then yes I would be pissed, but let's not go crazy until it really happens. Quite frankly, I couldn't care less about bringing in the standardized graphics and music. That all jumped the shark when they ditched their timeless Michael Randall theme. If they change the news content, though, the joke will be on them. That, I strongly agree. I didn't see any reason why they would want to get of a 23-year theme song that was basically their anthem. Since it already happened, four years ago, the musical part is careless to me, as we know that the OSI theme will be played. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mre29 1340 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Whoa..... I did NOT expect Fox to sell WFXT! And here I expect WHDH/WLVI to be the next major sale in the market... As for Boston, I am really pissed that we will loose half an O&O market. I know how WFXT is really rebellious against the O&O's format and all, but I wonder if the quality of news will go down the drain with Cox coming in. Especially when Rupert Murdoch can flaunt how WFXT is helluva lot more valuable than the rag newspaper called The Boston Globe. How is WFXT rebellious? I've never actually seen a newscast on a Fox O&O station other than WFXT, so I honestly have no way to compare it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ns8401 846 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 All I'm saying than that's your prerogative. And if you don't like it, that's fine. I'm not here to cater to you. I'm just stating my stance like I've always done, whether you like it or not. I meant what I said, and I make no apologies. Take that for what it's worth. I suppose you just cannot be reasoned with. You wonder why so many people get on your case on the board? The inflexibility is probably the main reason, then the ranting as well. I never asked you to cater to me. I merely asked you to open up and discuss it in a manner conducive to the environment we are in. You would get a lot less grief from people if you would simply discuss with us instead of simply making a statement and not wanting to discuss your reasoning or anything. I understand you mean what you say, otherwise why would you say it? I also did not ask you to apologize, merely to talk to me and the other person in a respectful manner about why you feel that way. You can make all of these over the top statements and disagree with everything anyone else says by only saying catch phrases, but it doesn't help you at all and we would like to have that discussion. I am baffled as to why this is so hard for you to do. I would gladly welcome a discussion about why you feel FOX would not keep the current logo or what you feel the long term impacts are. But merely spouting the same catch phrases in 5 different orders is not particularly funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrtraveler01 737 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Gotta admit, I'm shocked and surprised but also a little disappointed. It's going to be a sad day when they get standardized, even WTVT and WAGA seem to be hollow shells of their former selfs and Abernathy will probably have some more stupid experiments that he'll want to try out on KTVU. Looks like Fox 2 Bay Area is a reality. I'll be honest, I'd rather Cox be the owner than Fox. The current leadership for the O&O's has sucked whatever life was remaining out of them. Also can't figure out why WFXT and WHBQ were the ones included in this trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cg41386 131 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Well, if you say that I'm overdramatic, that's how you see it. And how do you know they're not going to change the "2" or not? I'm certainly hoping that they're going keep that iconic '75 Circle Laser 2 logo. But you have to realize this is Fox, and they will do anything to make it like the other O&Os. They can easily implement the standardization while keeping the 2. Two different posters have posted mock-up logos in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CircleSeven 1944 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 I suppose you just cannot be reasoned with. You wonder why so many people get on your case on the board? The inflexibility is probably the main reason, then the ranting as well. I never asked you to cater to me. I merely asked you to open up and discuss it in a manner conducive to the environment we are in. You would get a lot less grief from people if you would simply discuss with us instead of simply making a statement and not wanting to discuss your reasoning or anything. I understand you mean what you say, otherwise why would you say it? I also did not ask you to apologize, merely to talk to me and the other person in a respectful manner about why you feel that way. You can make all of these over the top statements and disagree with everything anyone else says by only saying catch phrases, but it doesn't help you at all and we would like to have that discussion. I am baffled as to why this is so hard for you to do. I would gladly welcome a discussion about why you feel FOX would not keep the current logo or what you feel the long term impacts are. But merely spouting the same catch phrases in 5 different orders is not particularly funny. Well you feel baffled, that's you feel. If you don't like what I say then that's fine. And I'm not here to be funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ns8401 846 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Well you feel baffled, that's you feel. If you don't like what I say then that's fine. And I'm not here to be funny. So you won't discuss your view on the swap with me? Even after I asked as politely as I could? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cg41386 131 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Gotta admit, I'm shocked and surprised but also a little disappointed. It's going to be a sad day when they get standardized, even WTVT and WAGA seem to be hollow shells of their former selfs and Abernathy will probably have some more stupid experiments that he'll want to try out on KTVU. Looks like Fox 2 Bay Area is a reality. Also can't figure out why WFXT and WHBQ were the ones included in this trade. WHBQ was originally for sale with the other O&Os that went to Local/Tribune, wasn't it? And also KTBC? But for some reason both ended up not being sold. No idea about WFXT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrtraveler01 737 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 WHBQ was originally for sale with the other O&Os that went to Local/Tribune, wasn't it? And also KTBC? But for some reason both ended up not being sold. No idea about WFXT. Local TV already owned WREG and couldn't sell it to them. But Fox did treat WHBQ and WFXT like the redheaded stepchildren of the group so they were probably anxious to get them. Odd thing is, I don't think Cox has any other presence in those cities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ns8401 846 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 All I'm saying than that's your prerogative. And if you don't like what's being said, that's fine. I'm not here to cater to you. I'm just stating my stance like I've always done, whether you like it or not. I meant what I said, and I make no apologies. Take that for what it's worth. Going back on topic, I'm strongly for them to at least keep the Circle Lazer 2 logo, because that's their history. But if Fox get's rid of it (and sadly they'll probably going to do it), it would certainly hurt me, but we have to realize Fox has standardize, just like Scripps, and yes if Scripps follows through with getting rid of MCTYW with Inergy, then yes I would be pissed, but let's not go crazy until it really happens. That, I strongly agree. I didn't see any reason why they would want to get of a 23-year theme song that was basically their anthem. Since it already happened, four years ago, the musical part is careless to me, as we know that the OSI theme will be played. We already know WKBW will be standardized, they showed that by doing it to everything else they own including WXYZ which took a major hit in standardizing, some others took downgrades as well. But as to the circle 2 logo, they will likely keep it, FOX isn't stupid and it wouldn't be hard to do something like that mock-up. But even if they did drop it, viewers will adjust, the logo isn't as important to the average viewer as it would be to you or I. I doubt so many changes would happen at once that they would suddenly not know what channel they were watching. The changes will be incremental more than likely. Ease everybody into the new ownership. They probably dumped the music back then because they felt it was long in the tooth, it happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CircleSeven 1944 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 So you won't discuss your view on the swap with me? Even after I asked as politely as I could? I'm already talking about the swap. Whether I'm talking about it with you or not, we'll just see what happens. They can easily implement the standardization while keeping the 2. Two different posters have posted mock-up logos in this thread. I've seen the mock-ups and I even complimented Raymie on doing that mock-up. That's actually a good compromise-able logo. The question would be whether they're going to use it or not. I'm not going to hold my breath though if they do. We already know WKBW will be standardized. But as to the circle 2 logo, they will likely keep it, FOX isn't stupid. They probably dumped the music back then because they felt it was long in the tooth, it happens. Well we don't know what Fox is going to do. I love the Circle Laser 2 logo, just like the folks in the Bay Area, and I would love it to be kept. But how do you know Fox isn't stupid to get rid of it? We all know that Fox is going standardized KTVU, just like Scripps is going to standardized and change its graphics for WKBW, that's a given. But Scripps is going to finally have the proper investment to compete with channels 2 & 4, and that's good for them. I'm worried however for KTVU, that it could be some forthcoming layoffs. But other than that, I don't think they'll touch their news content. And anyway, whoever thought of changing their iconic Randall theme, was stupid as hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrtraveler01 737 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 I actually think there's a strong possibility that Fox will maintain the status quo at KTVU, at least for the foreseeable future. We don't have much history here on which to base speculation—I don't think Fox Television Stations has acquired a station with a legacy and brand as strong as KTVU. Among FTS' recent acquisitions are WJZY (zero brand equity), WOFL (the station had an identity built around an effing palm tree) and KMSP. Of those, you can argue that KMSP had the most established brand, even though it started to erode under the final few years of Chris-Craft ownership—but even that brand (and overall ratings numbers) paled in comparison to KTVU. In all three of those examples, Fox didn't have much to lose by completely rebranding. There aren't a whole lot of positives that I can see coming from a holistic overhaul of KTVU; rather, the risk of alienating a very loyal viewer base is quite high. KTVU is, for all intents and purposes, the number one station in the market these days. The station is anything but broken, so any attempt to "fix" it would be misguided. The only ones you could compare this to are the stations Fox picked up from the New World deal back in the 1990's, a lot of local stations that alread had a strong local news presence (WAGA, WTVT, WJBK, etc.). It's been mostly a branding change (ie: Fox #, O&O music and graphics, etc.), but whenever Fox has some crazy idea to "reinvent the news" (ie: have 2 people argue about something or go overboard on what people on social media think), stations like WTVT have been taking part in that too. I guess I'm cautiously optimistic that Fox won't screw around with KTVU's current formula too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A3N 996 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 As I mentioned earlier, I think FOX will leave KTVU alone for the most part (aside from graphics, etc). That being said, if the station starts going downhill, then you can count on them making sweeping changes and those cuts will be coming left and right. The SF/Bay Area market is not Charlotte, KTVU is not a start up operation and I doubt/hope that FOX will not alienate their audience and disrupt their revenue streams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrtraveler01 737 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 As I mentioned earlier, I think FOX will leave KTVU alone for the most part (aside from graphics, etc). That being said, if the station starts going downhill, then you can count on them making sweeping changes and those cuts will be coming left and right. The SF/Bay Area market is not Charlotte, KTVU is not a start up operation and I doubt/hope that FOX will not alienate their audience and disrupt their revenue streams. True. I think WTVT and WAGA are real good examples of how Fox is probably going to run KTVU. Other bonus in this deal: No need to change voiceovers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColumbusNewsFan 217 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 I'm shocked but not for the obvious reasons. We all knew that FOX wanted stations in NFC markets but KTVU might be a target but that they pulled the trigger and did it. The question is will Tribune make the move here but I'm keeping my eye on New Orleans. Here's why, FOX 8 and the owner of The Saints and The Pelicans, Tom Benson. Benson brought the station and it is operated by Raycom with a SSA and we know how The FCC is dealing with those. So I'm watching New Orleans big time and see If FOX will make a move there. I wouldn't say it won't happen because we were saying KTVU will never be apart of FOX as an O&O... But It happen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrtraveler01 737 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 KTVU just ran a story on their 10PM newscast pretty much explaining the deal and telling us what we already knew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevieboy247 42 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 I wouldn't think KTVU would go the same direction as WJZ, where they would keep the same graphics, music, etc. The should at least keep the classic '2' logo though, with or without the circle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess 1110 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 I saw the report and what I've been struck by is the sense of... I don't know, resignation? unexcitement? coming from the KTVU camp. Maybe it's because when we went through similar ownership changes, like the 1995 switch, they were accompanied by campaigns that, using 10 as an example, shouted "WE'RE NBC NOW M*****F******!!!!!!! SEINFELD FRIENDS AND ER SUCK IT!!!!" Anyway, the major story on the site was just the press release. No local spin on it, no assurance that things will stay the same under Fox. It seemed almost funereal. --- Okay, now my thoughts. It is going to be interesting to see how this plays out, first off. All of Fox's acquisitions have been of smaller stations or big-three affiliates. I don't think any of Fox's stations, past or present, have the market dominance of KTVU. The closest comparison I would make would be Fox's acquisition of WTXF. Same basic story - day-one affiliation, established news department. Maybe they weren't Action News but The Ten O'Clock News was seen as a respectable newscast. When Fox bought it, the immediate changes (before they took control, even) included the rename of the station to "Fox Philadelphia". When it took over, Fox invested in the station - just a few months into their ownership they started Good Day Philadelphia. However, it kept most of the existing personnel on board. It really didn't "go Fox" until Roger LaMay left in 2003 or so, and there are still a number of people left from the LaMay era. That said, the Fox Television Stations of 1996 was not the Fox Television Stations of 2014. For one, it was run competently. I've said it before and I'll say it again. As long as Roger Ailes and Jack Abernethy are running the ship, Fox has no credibility with me on a local level. The current incarnation of WTXF is not bad. But the actions taken by corporate ruined the station - which for years had been one of my go-to choices or news - to the point where I stopped watching. I still haven't restarted. Every time I see or hear Abernethy going on about the future of local stations and the death of the anchorman I just want to go up to him and sock him in the jaw. The local product reflects this. The centralized graphics are shit. The locals have tried to work with it, but the Tampa hub keeps pumping out lame, generic graphic after lame, generic graphic. It doesn't feel like they try to put out a decent look. Artworks, Scripps Tampa, and G3 at least TRY. I'd like to think that Fox understands that KTVU, as it is, is not broken. I don't think that. A company that continues to give Patrick Paolini, who I'd argue created the absolute worst product in the history of this market, gainful employment is not a company that understands local news. A company that is content to see the absolute shitshow in Chicago continue and continue is not a company that understands local news. A company that creates Phillies baseball playoff graphics BASED OFF OF THE FREAKING TAMPA BAY RAYS LOGO is not a company that understands local news. I'm not doom and glooming. I'm really not - but there are going to be a lot of layoffs and non-renewals happening at KTVU as it adjusts - painfully - into the Fox mold. Groups that are dictated from the top down the way Fox seems to be are not companies I'd trust to run a local station. That's all from me. Good luck and have Batman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samantha 2878 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 The question is will Tribune make the move here but I'm keeping my eye on New Orleans. Here's why, FOX 8 and the owner of The Saints and The Pelicans, Tom Benson. Benson brought the station and it is operated by Raycom with a SSA and we know how The FCC is dealing with those. So I'm watching New Orleans big time and see If FOX will make a move there. Raycom does not own a television station license in New Orleans. That JSA/SSA is compliant for that reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broadcastfan9751 136 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 It definitely makes sense for Fox to get an O&O in San Francisco, since it is an NFC market, but giving up another station in a Top 10 market (Boston)?!? But then again, Boston is an AFC market and Fox appears to be only interested in NFC markets, so that's probably why they were willing to include WFXT in the deal. As for WHBQ, Fox has been wanting to sell it for a while now and they finally get to do that with this deal. But what's even more surprising is that they finally got Cox to give up KTVU after all these years! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrtraveler01 737 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 It definitely makes sense for Fox to get an O&O in San Francisco, since it is an NFC market, but giving up another station in a Top 10 market (Boston)?!? But then again, Boston is an AFC market and Fox appears to be only interested in NFC markets, so that's probably why they were willing to include WFXT in the deal. As for WHBQ, Fox has been wanting to sell it for a while now and they finally get to do that with this deal. But what's even more surprising is that they finally got Cox to give up KTVU after all these years! Another reason I've seen people speculate is that this would give News Corp the chance to buy the Boston Herald. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
channel2 869 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Which, ironically, the old News Corp used to own (and if Murdoch does buy it back, it'll be the second time it figures into WFXT's history). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasTVNews 1366 Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Here's the video on KTVU's soon-to-be new owners. http://www.ktvu.com/videos/news/oakland-fox-television-stations-acquires-ktvu-kicu/vCgBt7/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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